In the 7th episode of the SpicyIP Podcast Summer School Edition, it was a pleasure to speak with Ms. Kruttika Vijay, Partner at Ira Law, and former blogger on SpicyIP. During her sessions in the Summer School, it was fascinating to see her passion for a subject like Civil Procedure Code (generally considered ‘dry’ in law schools) carry over to the students, and transform the sessions into an interesting and engaging experience. Not just that, her practical pointers on court craft and thought provoking hypotheticals made many students seriously consider IP litigation as a career for the first time!
We were honoured to have her join on the podcast. In this episode, I speak to her about the behind-the-scenes of making a career in IP litigation, effective client communication as well as other skills to develop as a legal professional, beyond just classroom learning.
Keep a watch out for some golden insights from her that include the importance of having a good hold of the basics as crucial to moving beyond one’s specific niche, client communication being a subjective process, as well as importance of “discipline” and “prioritization” in establishing oneself as a professional. The two pointers of effective client communication: “Put the client at ease” and “Demonstrate that you can deliver what you promise” stands as a reminder to think from the client’s perspective while engaging with them.
Scroll down to the podcast and find out more from her about qualities to develop as a legal professional. (Earlier episodes include: 01 with Mr. Murali Neelakantan here, 02 with Mr. Sandeep Rathod here, 03 with Mr. Adarsh Ramanujan here, 04 with Ms. Chetali Rao here, 05 with Mr. KM Gopakumar here and 06 with Ms. Zara Kaushik here.)
SpicyIP TV: The Summer School Edition – Episode 07 Kruttika Vijay on Preparing for a Career in IP litigation
In this episode (07), Sonisha Srinivasan speaks to Ms Kruttika Vijay (bio below), an experienced litigator about what it takes to build a career in IP litigation. She sheds light on the realities of the field, along with valuable guidance for students who want to pursue this niche. She also shares her thoughts on effective client communication as well as reflects on other important qualities to develop as a legal professional.
About Kruttika Vijay: Kruttika Vijay, Partner at Ira Law, is an experienced litigator who focuses on intellectual property litigation, civil and commercial dispute resolution, and intellectual property advisory and prosecution. She regularly appears in various courts across India and has also had the privilege of appearing before the Supreme Court of India as first chair. She is currently also a panel counsel for the Government of the National Capital Territory of Delhi in the District Courts, Delhi. She is an alumna of Stanford Law School, and NALSAR University of Law.
SS: We have a few questions for you today, ma’am. For students who want to get into IP litigation, do you have any guidance or suggestions or things they could do to get into a niche of IP litigation?
KV: I think, first of all, thank you for doing this. I think when you want to do something like IP litigation, like you said, it’s such a niche area. One of the things that I would tell students, and it’s something I wish I had done more, is to read. It’s so SpicyIP. When I started, blogging was a great way for me to actually keep up to date with everything that’s going on. But if I didn’t have that, then there was no way for me to actually have kept abreast of what’s happening in IP. One of the major issues I feel we have in India is that there are no good IP books. So when you don’t have a good IP commentary that you can rely on, the only way you can actually keep track of what’s going on is to read case law. So if you want to do IP litigation, especially, and it is case law heavy, it’s to read. It is to write if you can. And if you want to do litigation in general, it’s to do internships with practicing lawyers or with judges so that you can experience what it is to be in court firsthand. It’s not always glamorous. A lot of it is just sitting around. A lot of it is adjournments. But when it does happen, it’s magic. So those sort of things that I think that students should know firsthand. And the way to do it is at least go to court. So that’s what I would say. Right.
SS: And since like yesterday, you took a class on CPC. So what do you think is the importance of, so if somebody wants to get into a niche like IP, what do you think is the importance of other subjects which go along with it? Like how you explained about CPC or any other subject that you feel would go along with it, which would help the students in their specific niche?
KV: So I think things like CPC and, you know, the Limitation Act, Commercial Courts Act, these are basics. If you know these and if you have an interest in these, you will always be able to transfer that knowledge, even if you want to move out of the niche. And there will come a time when you’re doing, even when you’re doing IP litigation, you may want to do more things because it does get repetitive. So if you have a base in at least procedure, it’s easy to transfer that knowledge. Having said that, when you want to do others, if you want to do IP litigation now, especially because of the Commercial Courts Act, I think one of the good things for students to do is also keep track of other commercial laws because so much of what is held in those subject areas is applicable to us in terms of timelines. Judges also, sorry, I’ll take one step back. I think what you have to realize is that when you’re in a court, while you may be an IP lawyer, the judge is almost certainly not going to be someone who has an IP background. Very few judges come from an IP background, and everybody likes familiarity. Everybody understands basics. All of these judges usually have a vast practice before they come to court, especially those who have been lawyers before. So they will understand contract law far sooner than they will understand trademarks. They will understand arbitration because they’re more likely to have come across arbitration matters than they would have been able to come across a trademark matter or a patent matter. So the second you’re able to explain concepts. to them in that context, and then use an analogy when you’re arguing, or the second you’re able to draw on case law, they will know that you are also reading up and clued in, and it will give them a hold on a subject that they’re not familiar with much faster. So, and things like interpretation are universal. So especially with commercial subjects, I think it would make sense for students to start reading up on, you know, contract law, arbitration. Competition, all of these things generally help.
SS: And even when things like patent cases are involved, there will be a lot of scientific things involved that the judge would have to be explained. So I think an idea of science is also important ?
KV: It is, but it doesn’t come to everyone easily. I would say I’m like, the reason I’m a lawyer is because I couldn’t do anything in science. But I think at least, at least this is what I like to tell my clients. And I, I do believe it’s true, is that even if I take a little while to understand the science, to me, it is an advantage because like I said, again, judges don’t have that background, so they will need someone to explain it to them. And you have an expert who comes in, explains it to them. If you have a good expert, they will bring it down to the basics so that a judge can understand. But otherwise someone like me who really has to understand like, you know, complete foundational level science to explain anything. If I have to explain a technology to a judge, it may help the judge also understand because I’ve gone through that same process of understanding how a technology is, why the patent is, what is the inventive step. So I think all of those things will also help. I’m not sure if there’s any sort of science that you can read, which will generally help because every invention is different. Um, but I think it, it, it does help to have an open mind and be prepared to admit that you don’t know a lot about a lot of things so that you can learn the basics.
SS: Another thing that you’ve been mentioning is about client, …, the importance of client communication. … That’s something we’re mentioning even in class. So, how do you think, … I mean, and obviously that’s a skill, which is to be developed over time with experience. How do you think a student can develop such a skill or what are the other skills out of law school, … or out of what is taught in law schools that is necessary for students say in terms of, uh, client communication or even understanding the business around, the subjects, or how to approach a particular case, how to, you know, argue in a certain way. What are those things which a student could develop while coming to litigation?
KV: I think client communication or client handling generally is something everyone does very differently And it has to be something that makes sense to you. So what I mean by that is so I am someone who doesn’t spend my time. Yes, I read case law, but other than that, I don’t spend my time thinking about the law at all. I read about sports, I read about politics, so I don’t like discussing politics. I read about cooking, I read about, you know, fantasy football. I, I have. I have a lot of interests outside just the law. And so it does help a little bit with small talk and, you know, it, it’s, uh, it, but that’s something that comes… I would like to think it comes naturally to me. If it doesn’t come naturally to you, people will know. And that’s not to say that they will Okay. So client handling client communication generally is an uncomfortable thing for everyone. Everyone knows you’re trying to get their business. So they also are trying to figure out why they should give you that.
First thing, at least for me is to put the client at ease. One that, you know, I’m a decent human being and two is that I can actually do what I’m talking about. And when that, that will come very easily, once you start working, because there is no use pretending that, you know, something that you don’t, you should not lie to a client that’s unfair to the client. Um, but if you do know something, um, it’s easy enough to talk about it and clients appreciate that honesty and transparency when you’re talking about them. So being reliable, being responsive, being available, you know, it’s a, it’s the sad truth of our profession that you are required to be available a lot of the times, even if you, it does not give you the ideal work life balance. Um, but it’s just a reality. And I think you get used to it unless you start setting boundaries much earlier, which I think is a thing that’s happening more. And more now. Okay. Um, but having said that, yeah, I think client, uh, handling is something that should come naturally to you.
Students should start being more, uh, disciplined and start being more, start thinking more about how they utilize time because you have a finite number of hours a day and you will have a million things to do. Right. So, uh, this is something that, you know, Zara was speaking about yesterday during, when we were having our discussions and, uh, she’s. She’s absolutely right. Work smart. It’s not something I can say I do every day. I have a different method of working, but I think the important thing is to realize that work has to get done no matter what. And if, when you have to give in work, it has to be a reflection on who you think you are as a professional, and you won’t want to turn in substandard work, which means you should give yourself enough time to actually do that work. So that’s what I mean by work smart. I think you need to be efficient, which is why you need to be disciplined. You need to have some sort of routine, even though it may not be a routine that you can have every day. And that sort of thing happens. If you practice it early on, it’s not something that you can do overnight.
SS: Right. Right. Uh, thank you so much, ma’am. It was great talking to you. Thanks so much. And I’m sure like when students look through this, there’s going to be a lot of insights on, uh, different things. And a lot of things that are usually not spoken about, usually not taught in law schools, but, uh, a lot of other important things, which a student would need while coming to practice. Thank you so much.
KV: Thank you so much. It was a pleasure talking to you.